Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
June 26, 2017, 12:36:40 PM

256996
visitors since
june 16, 2005
+  History-Book Forum
|-+  New Chronology Discussion
| |-+  Mediterranean Chronology
| | |-+  The Heroic Age of Greece
« previous next »
Pages: [1] Go Down Print
Author Topic: The Heroic Age of Greece  (Read 6841 times)
theelf29
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 278



View Profile
The Heroic Age of Greece
« on: August 18, 2007, 02:39:37 AM »

Hello all,

Is there anyone who has an interest in this period?
Logged
Raffael
newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 5



View Profile
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2007, 01:00:10 AM »

yes, unfortunately i dont know that much about it
Logged
theelf29
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 278



View Profile
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2007, 01:30:15 AM »

I'm trying to pull some data on the period together (king lists, genealogies, and the like). I'm just gauging interest to see if anyone would care to see it.
Logged
Cush
administrator
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 274



View Profile WWW
Dynasties of Hellas
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2007, 11:43:21 AM »

Well, right now there is pretty little in my database about Greek dynasties...

Dynasties of HellasDynasties-
Line of Inachus-
∑ ∑ InachusKhyan
1255
-
1226
∑ ∑ IoAhhotep
1194
-
1180
∑ ∑ EpaphusApophis
1209
-
1195
∑ ∑ Libya-
∑ ∑ Agenor-
∑ ∑ Telephassa*ArgiopŽ-
∑ ∑ Belus-
∑ ∑ Cilix-
∑ ∑ Europa-
Line of Danaus-
∑ ∑ Danaus-
∑ ∑ Hypermestra-
∑ ∑ Lynceus-
∑ ∑ Abas-
∑ ∑ Proetus-
∑ ∑ Acrisius-
∑ ∑ Danae-
∑ ∑ Polydectes-
∑ ∑ Perseus-
∑ ∑ GorgophonŽ-
∑ ∑ Electryon-
∑ ∑ Alkeus-
∑ ∑ Sthelenus-
∑ ∑ AlcmenŽ-
∑ ∑ Amphitryon-
∑ ∑ Eurytheus-
∑ ∑ HeraclesHercules-
∑ ∑ Hyllus-
Line of Pelops-
∑ ∑ Tantalus-
∑ ∑ Pelops-
∑ ∑ Atreus-
∑ ∑ Thyestes-
∑ ∑ Agamemnon-
∑ ∑ Clytemnestra-
∑ ∑ Menelaos-
∑ ∑ Aegisthos-
∑ ∑ Orestes-
∑ ∑ Iphigenia-
∑ ∑ Tisamenos-
Line of Cadmus-
∑ ∑ Cadmus-
∑ ∑ Polydoros-
∑ ∑ Labdacos-
∑ ∑ Laius-
∑ ∑ Oedipus-
∑ ∑ Polyneices-
∑ ∑ Eteocles-
Rulers of Lacedaemon-
∑ ∑ Lelex-
∑ ∑ Myles-
∑ ∑ Eurotas-
∑ ∑ Lacedaemon-
∑ ∑ Sparta-
∑ ∑ Amyclas-
∑ ∑ Argalos-
∑ ∑ Cynortas-
∑ ∑ Oibalos-
∑ ∑ Tyndareos-
∑ ∑ Hippokoon-
∑ ∑ Helena-
∑ ∑ HermionŽ-

Kings of Sparta



« Last Edit: August 25, 2007, 07:41:19 PM by Cush » Logged
Cush
administrator
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 274



View Profile WWW
Pelasgian rulers of Crete
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2007, 12:30:03 PM »

Pelasgian rulers of Crete
Cadmus(of Tyre)
1140
-
1100
Dorus
1100
-
1080
Tectamus
1080
-
1060
Minos the ElderMinos 1
1060
-
1010
Lycastrus
1010
-
980
Minos the YoungerMinos 2
980
-
935
Deucalion
935
-
920
Catreus
920
-
895
Atreus
905
-
890
Idomeneus
895
-
862
Thyestes
890
-
889
Agamemnon(of Mukenai)
889
-
863
Nauplius
?
-
?
Clymene
?
-
?

Line of Kekrops (of Athens)
Krekrops 1
?
-
?
Kranaus
?
-
?
Amphykiton
?
-
?
Erichthonius
?
-
?
Pandion 1
?
-
?
Erechtheus
?
-
?
Krekrops 2
?
-
?
Pandion 2
?
-
?
Aegeus
?
-
?
Theseus
?
-
?
Menestheus
?
-
?
« Last Edit: August 25, 2007, 09:30:19 PM by Cush » Logged
theelf29
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 278



View Profile
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2007, 09:13:05 PM »

Hmmm..... the Line of Kekrops you've placed on Crete are traditionally the kings of Athens Smiley
Logged
Cush
administrator
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 274



View Profile WWW
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2007, 09:29:36 PM »

Hmmm..... the Line of Kekrops you've placed on Crete are traditionally the kings of Athens Smiley
Oh...  Roll Eyes Grin
fixed.
Logged
theelf29
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 278



View Profile
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2007, 10:15:13 PM »

Rohl's dates for the Kings of Sparta are more or less correct in my opinion. However, due to their approximate nature, they will need a little fine-tuning.

For example, at present, Rohl dates Teleclus of the Agiad line 668-648, roughly contemporary & surviving Theopompus of the Eurypontid line.

However, Pausanias has Teleclus die a generation before the First Messenian War, killed at the shrine of Artemis at Limnatis by the Messenians (seen as a direct precursor of the conflict that would erupt some years later). This is dated by Pausanias to the reign of Phintas at Stenyclerus.

"The Lacedaemonians say that they went to war because Polychares was not surrendered to them, and on account of the murder of Teleclus; even before this they had been suspicious on account of the wrongdoing of Cresphontes in the matter of the lot."

- Pausanias, "Description of Greece" Book 4.5.1 (emphasis mine)


Teleclus' son Alcamenes leads the first major advance in the war, against Ampheia, but he too dies early on, succeeded by Polydorus. (ibid., 4.7.7)

Theopompus can be inferred to have had a long reign, as he was eventually succeeded, according to Pausanias, by his grandson Zeuxidamas. He may have continued to reign some years after the war with Messenia, as Pausanias records conflict with Argos over the Thyreatid district. (ibid., 3.7.5-6)

Kind regards,

Graham John Smiley
Logged
Cush
administrator
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 274



View Profile WWW
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2007, 06:06:13 PM »

The (incomplete) list of Aegean Dynasties and their rulers can from now on be found >here<.
Logged
theelf29
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 278



View Profile
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2007, 02:26:16 PM »

I have a few king lists for the various city states from Mycenaean times down, in some cases, into the Iron Age.

I will attempt to create dates (referring to "Lords of Avaris" wherever possible Smiley) and get these posted.
Logged
theelf29
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 278



View Profile
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2007, 07:10:49 PM »

One major problem for downdating the Greek Bronze Age is the list of Archons of Athens. This is often regarded, however, as a later invention. I post it here for the sake of information. Any ideas as to how this can be reconciled with the NC dates without throwing it out?

Perpetual Archons
Medon (son of Codrus)1069-1049
Acastus1049-1013
Archippus1013-994
Thersippus994-953
Phorbas953-922
Megacles922-892
Diognetus892-864
Pherecles864-845
Ariphron845-825
Thespieus825-798
Agamestor798-778
Aeschylus778-755
Alcmaeon855-753
Dicennial Archons
Charops753-743
Aesimides743-733
Clidicus733-723
Hippomenes723-713
Leocrates713-703
Apsander703-693
Eryxias693-683

For my part, a combination of lack of information on each archon, coupled with suspiciously long reign lengths (perpetual archons, in most cases) along with all of the dicennial archons seeing out their allotted term, smacks of a fiction.
Logged
Cush
administrator
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 274



View Profile WWW
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #11 on: September 17, 2007, 09:19:56 PM »

One major problem for downdating the Greek Bronze Age is the list of Archons of Athens. This is often regarded, however, as a later invention. I post it here for the sake of information. Any ideas as to how this can be reconciled with the NC dates without throwing it out?
If there aren't any reliable synchronisms to confirm at least some of the dates I would still keep these data in the db but set them to "invisible". >list<

For my part, a combination of lack of information on each archon, coupled with suspiciously long reign lengths (perpetual archons, in most cases) along with all of the dicennial archons seeing out their allotted term, smacks of a fiction.
Well, that would be like the sequential-dynasties-of-Egypt-syndrome...  Sad

« Last Edit: September 17, 2007, 10:04:46 PM by Cush » Logged
theelf29
researcher
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 278



View Profile
Re: The Heroic Age of Greece
« Reply #12 on: September 17, 2007, 10:10:15 PM »

For my part, a combination of lack of information on each archon, coupled with suspiciously long reign lengths (perpetual archons, in most cases) along with all of the dicennial archons seeing out their allotted term, smacks of a fiction.
Well, that would be like the sequential-dynasties-of-Egypt-syndrome... Sad
Yup. Or, if not Egypt, excessively-early-Trojan-War-disease. Symptoms of ehich also include a noticeable extension of the Alba Longa.... Wink
Logged
Pages: [1] Go Up Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length
History-Book Forum | Powered by SMF 1.0.8.
© 2001-2005, Lewis Media. All Rights Reserved.